Found A Trojan!

On that special day, Morgan Ohlson, (morgan.ohlson@comhem.se) said...

> Where is the Kaspersky located on the web?

You could always try www.kaspersky.com

It seems logical, after all.


Gabriele Neukam

Gabriele.Spamfighter.Neukam DeleteThis @t-online.de


--
Ah, Information. A property, too valuable these days, to give it away,
just so, at no cost.
 >> Stay informed about: Found A Trojan! 

Art wrote:
[snip]
> I appreciate your and David's comments, max. Another factor in my
> disinterest in emergency utils is that there's no reason that users
> who have just a little clue should ever take malware/spyware hits.

oh my, mr. emperor, sir, what fabulous new clothes you have...

there are no perfect preventative measures - detection of preventative
failures and recovery from them will always have to be part of the
equation... they can be minimized, but never eliminated...

> I'm far more interested in helping people learn a few simple things
> about staying malware and spyware free.

ok, but just be careful you don't put all your eggs in one basket...

--
"they threw a rope around yer neck to watch you dance the jig of death
then left ya for the starvin' crows, hoverin' like hungry whores
one flew down plucked out yer eye, the other he had in his sights
ya snarled at him, said leave me be - i need the bugger so i can see"
 >> Stay informed about: Found A Trojan! 

Art wrote:
> On Sat, 03 Sep 2005 15:22:43 -0400, kurt wismer <kurtw.DeleteThis@sympatico.ca>
>>Art wrote:
>>[snip]
>>
>>>I appreciate your and David's comments, max. Another factor in my
>>>disinterest in emergency utils is that there's no reason that users
>>>who have just a little clue should ever take malware/spyware hits.
>>
>>oh my, mr. emperor, sir, what fabulous new clothes you have...
>>
>>there are no perfect preventative measures - detection of preventative
>>failures and recovery from them will always have to be part of the
>>equation... they can be minimized, but never eliminated...
>
> So what? Many of us never take hits. Prevention is no big mystery.
> Anyone who is really interested can learn to be spyware and malware
> free. You don't have to be a guru.

that's not the point... you're saying that by using proper preventative
measures a person will never have cause to take restorative measures and
that's just wrong...

just because you've never taken a hit yet doesn't mean you never will or
that other people taking the same measures as you never will... it would
be nice if we could prevent everything, but that just isn't the case...

--
"they threw a rope around yer neck to watch you dance the jig of death
then left ya for the starvin' crows, hoverin' like hungry whores
one flew down plucked out yer eye, the other he had in his sights
ya snarled at him, said leave me be - i need the bugger so i can see"
 >> Stay informed about: Found A Trojan! 

What's in a Name? wrote:
[snip]
> I see that kurt has some issues with you.

issues with art personally? no nothing of the sort...

issues with the sentiment he's just expressed, but not with him... it
smacks of growing too full of one's own success at preventing malware to
accept that recovery might still be necessary sometimes...

> Oh well.....won't go there.
> One thing though,I agree that "prevention is no big mystery" and that a
> layered defence along with "safe-hex" is best.

just make sure one of those layers includes recovery preparations... no
preventative measure is perfect...

--
"they threw a rope around yer neck to watch you dance the jig of death
then left ya for the starvin' crows, hoverin' like hungry whores
one flew down plucked out yer eye, the other he had in his sights
ya snarled at him, said leave me be - i need the bugger so i can see"
 >> Stay informed about: Found A Trojan! 

How do you close ports?
What services are unnecessary?

>In my case, I've never used realtime
> av or any other realtime defense method other than my head. I harden
> my PCs and use good internet apps, and that's it.
>
> Hardening (closing all ports, removing unnecessary services, and
> patching) is easiest on the Win 9X/ME series.
 >> Stay informed about: Found A Trojan! 

Art wrote:
> On Mon, 05 Sep 2005 08:45:33 -0400, kurt wismer <kurtw.RemoveThis@sympatico.ca>
>
>>>>there are no perfect preventative measures - detection of preventative
>>>>failures and recovery from them will always have to be part of the
>>>>equation... they can be minimized, but never eliminated...
>>>
>>>So what? Many of us never take hits. Prevention is no big mystery.
>>>Anyone who is really interested can learn to be spyware and malware
>>>free. You don't have to be a guru.
>>
>>that's not the point... you're saying that by using proper preventative
>>measures a person will never have cause to take restorative measures and
>>that's just wrong...
>
> Not true. I never said or even implied such nonsense.

your words were:
"Another factor in my
disinterest in emergency utils is that there's no reason that users
who have just a little clue should ever take malware/spyware hits."

that pretty clearly implies that people should be able to prevent
malware in all cases if they do the right set of things...

>>just because you've never taken a hit yet doesn't mean you never will or
>>that other people taking the same measures as you never will... it would
>>be nice if we could prevent everything, but that just isn't the case...
>
> That seems so obvious, I don't understand why you feel compelled to
> say it.
>
> I've spelled out my philososphy many times on the lists. I'm a strong
> proponent of hardnening the OS and using alternate internet apps. What
> annoys me is advice to simply use some av and firewall. That's what
> too often implies your "perfect security" kind of horsecrap. We see
> people on the lists all the time who use av and firewall and take
> hits.

hardening the OS and using alternative internet apps are just other
forms of prevention... prevention is important and i don't disagree, but
it is not the end of security, it is only the beginning...

you have clearly indicated that if people know what they're doing they
should never take malware hits and therefore never need to follow
recovery procedures - that implies that the preventative measures they
employ never fail and are therefore perfect... i'm just pointing out the
fallacy in that - no matter how good your preventative measures are, no
matter how much of a clue you have or put to good use, there will always
be reasons for people to use "emergency utils"...

--
"they threw a rope around yer neck to watch you dance the jig of death
then left ya for the starvin' crows, hoverin' like hungry whores
one flew down plucked out yer eye, the other he had in his sights
ya snarled at him, said leave me be - i need the bugger so i can see"
 >> Stay informed about: Found A Trojan! 

Art wrote:
> On Mon, 05 Sep 2005 17:14:34 -0400, kurt wismer <kurtw.RemoveThis@sympatico.ca>
[snip]
>>your words were:
>>"Another factor in my
>>disinterest in emergency utils is that there's no reason that users
>>who have just a little clue should ever take malware/spyware hits."
>>
>>that pretty clearly implies that people should be able to prevent
>>malware in all cases if they do the right set of things...
>
>
> Would the emperor be slightly more happy with "rarely"
> rather than "never" ? Or does the emperor take so many
> hits that he'd be happier with "cut down on the number of hits"?

it has nothing to do with the number of hits i take or don't take...

> No matter. I'll stick with my statement no matter what the emperor
> says

and i'll stick with my 'emperor's new clothes' remark, as you clearly
aren't seeing you've left something (the possibility of failure)
uncovered...

--
"they threw a rope around yer neck to watch you dance the jig of death
then left ya for the starvin' crows, hoverin' like hungry whores
one flew down plucked out yer eye, the other he had in his sights
ya snarled at him, said leave me be - i need the bugger so i can see"
 >> Stay informed about: Found A Trojan! 

Art wrote:
> On Wed, 07 Sep 2005 07:31:17 -0400, kurt wismer <kurtw.TakeThisOut@sympatico.ca>
[snip]
>>>>"Another factor in my
>>>>disinterest in emergency utils is that there's no reason that users
>>>>who have just a little clue should ever take malware/spyware hits."
[snip]
> No. I said "should ever" (take hits). I didn't say "absolutely will
> not ever" take hits.

i'd rather not get into this level of pedantry, but when one says 'there
is no reason X should happen' it is equivalent to saying 'X should never
happen'...

in this case X will happen so the statement is wrong...

> There's a big difference. Your snide "emperor"
> remark was uncalled for. I don't know what your purpose is in trying
> to paint me as a snake oil peddler, but I don't like it. So get bent.

snake-oil? if i were trying to paint you as a snake-oil peddler i'd have
used the term "snake-oil"... i'd have used it early and i'd have used it
often...

the only thing i was trying to paint you as was being in error... that
and (in a joking way) oblivious to the error (except the joke turned
serious)...

--
"they threw a rope around yer neck to watch you dance the jig of death
then left ya for the starvin' crows, hoverin' like hungry whores
one flew down plucked out yer eye, the other he had in his sights
ya snarled at him, said leave me be - i need the bugger so i can see"
 >> Stay informed about: Found A Trojan!